So...Cecil the Lion and the Dentist

Gypsy-Vanner · Post by **Gypsy-Vanner** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:29 pm

So...this dentist has received some fairly horrible backlash in shooting a well known lion and I have to say the death threats and the calls for him to be shot with an arrow, skinned, and then beheaded are a bit too bloodthirsty for me.

I mean, I have followed Cecil for a few years now, checking up on him every so often and the videos and web live feed they used to do. He was a magnificent lion in that he sired many cubs that had an above average survival rate and he held his position for longer than the average male lion with a pride. At 13 years old, he was showing signs of deterioration but he was still magnificent.

I am angry this happened. I am angry this man made a complete non-apology apology and that he blamed his "guides" when he has gone hunting in Southern Africa countries many times before and knows damn well the rules and whatnot and to be very clear here, Cecil's GPS collar was visible AND the "guides" had access to a SS antenna which would have picked up the signal on Cecils collar which would have told them he was off limits but they conveniently didn't have one with them?

The whole thing is rotten and this man's past history of hunting illegally tells us he has an issue and could continue to have issues so a fit punishment should be enacted. But calling for his death and his family and some of the really awful things being said made me kind of sick. I mean, seeing a picture of this dude makes me want to go all Hulk and whatnot but I'd just punch him, people are being so crazed in their calls for vengeance.

It just disturbs me.

Blade Azaezel · Post by **Blade Azaezel** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:45 pm

People can call for what they want on the internet, it turns everyone into the worst possible version of themselves. They all need to fucking die

Gypsy-Vanner · Post by **Gypsy-Vanner** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 9:51 pm

I'm gunna Hulk Smash you.

Post by **OpiateOfTheMasses** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:46 pm

I agree that people who saying they're "going to kill someone for X" are invariably over-reacting and almost wouldn't say that to the person's face.

But I can see why people are getting worked up about this. I have absolutely no problem with people hunting for food. Or hunting to protect their families or livestock from a real threat. But those people that like to go out killing animals for fun are just a bit fucked up in my opinion. It's not a "sport" - how can it be a "sport" when you're using a ranged weapon from a concealed position to kill an animal that doesn't know you're there?

I really think people who enjoy killing for the sake of killing should both be barred from owning any form of weaponry other than kitchen knives and they should be compelled to be psychologically evaluated.

My two cents.

Derived Absurdity · Post by **Derived Absurdity** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:54 pm

A dude I've known for years hunts for sport, I've just recently learned. That would be bad enough, as I agree anyone who hunts for sport is fucked in the head. But he doesn't even really "hunt", or at least not how I understand the term. First of all, he never ventures out of his own backyard. It's several acres big, but still. And he goes up in a makeshift tower or some shit right in the middle of a big open field and just waits until a deer comes along, and then shoots them from there. He doesn't even track them down or whatever.

It's like... why the fuck would you even do that? How is that even fun? Where's the thrill you get from that? I never asked him, but seriously, what the fuck.

Dr_Liszt · Post by **Dr_Liszt** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 11:24 pm

More proof dentists are evil people.

Cassius Clay · Post by **Cassius Clay** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 11:25 pm

The hunter gets hunted.

Oh...how the turn tables...turn

Unvoiced_Apollo · Post by **Unvoiced_Apollo** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 11:58 pm

OpiateOfTheMasses wrote:I agree that people who saying they're "going to kill someone for X" are invariably over-reacting and almost wouldn't say that to the person's face.

But I can see why people are getting worked up about this. I have absolutely no problem with people hunting for food. Or hunting to protect their families or livestock from a real threat. But those people that like to go out killing animals for fun are just a bit fucked up in my opinion. It's not a "sport" - how can it be a "sport" when you're using a ranged weapon from a concealed position to kill an animal that doesn't know you're there?

I really think people who enjoy killing for the sake of killing should both be barred from owning any form of weaponry other than kitchen knives and they should be compelled to be psychologically evaluated.

My two cents.

This is why I like my idea for sport hunting: two knives duct taped to your fists.

CashRules · Post by **CashRules** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 12:26 am

It's not at all like wild animals have evolved to be aware of their surroundings while humans evolved to counteract those adaptations by using our brains to develop weapons. Nope, sitting in a tree stand guarantees that every deer within a hundred mile radius is going to unwittingly wander out into the open and give the hunter an easy shot. That foot stomping that deer always do when they detect the presence of a predator they can't see, the real reason for that is because the deer's foot has gone numb and the deer is trying to improve the circulation. No, wild animals are completely helpless against hunters because the hunter has all the advantages. In fact, the human sense of smell is so superior to whatever animal is being hunted that the human is always going to know the animal is there long before the animal detects the human. Humans can also outrun any fleeing prey and animals don't have the sense to keep obstacles between them and the guy with the gun.

But anyway, guided hunts are for sissies who have no business hunting. There is no such thing as "illegal hunting". There is hunting and there is poaching. It's like illegal art collecting. There is art collecting and there is art theft.

^One of the two above paragraphs is serious and the other is sarcasm.

Monk · Post by **Monk** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 2:45 pm

There is no such thing as "illegal hunting". There is hunting and there is poaching. It's like illegal art collecting. There is art collecting and there is art theft.

I hope this is the sarcastic one.

Post by **OpiateOfTheMasses** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:13 pm

CashRules wrote:It's not at all like wild animals have evolved to be aware of their surroundings while humans evolved to counteract those adaptations by using our brains to develop weapons. Nope, sitting in a tree stand guarantees that every deer within a hundred mile radius is going to unwittingly wander out into the open and give the hunter an easy shot. That foot stomping that deer always do when they detect the presence of a predator they can't see, the real reason for that is because the deer's foot has gone numb and the deer is trying to improve the circulation. No, wild animals are completely helpless against hunters because the hunter has all the advantages. In fact, the human sense of smell is so superior to whatever animal is being hunted that the human is always going to know the animal is there long before the animal detects the human. Humans can also outrun any fleeing prey and animals don't have the sense to keep obstacles between them and the guy with the gun.

But anyway, guided hunts are for sissies who have no business hunting. There is no such thing as "illegal hunting". There is hunting and there is poaching. It's like illegal art collecting. There is art collecting and there is art theft.

^One of the two above paragraphs is serious and the other is sarcasm.

If all hunters want is the thrill of stalking the animals and proving they can "beat" the animals' senses that's one thing.

But why does it have to end with them killing the animal? What does that prove?

CashRules · Post by **CashRules** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:19 pm

It proves they can hit what they're shooting at. Besides, I oppose hunting just to be killing something. But as long as somebody eats what they kill and it's not an endangered species then it shouldn't be seen as a problem by anybody.

Unvoiced_Apollo · Post by **Unvoiced_Apollo** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:56 pm

CashRules wrote:It proves they can hit what they're shooting at. Besides, I oppose hunting just to be killing something. But as long as somebody eats what they kill and it's not an endangered species then it shouldn't be seen as a problem by anybody.

This is pretty much my attitude towards hunting as well.

My idea stems from trophy hunting. You're not working to earn a trophy like any other athlete or sports star. You're in a goddamn tree stand waiting for an unsuspecting victim. If you're going to hunt as a trophy sport, you should put some goddamn work into it.

CashRules · Post by **CashRules** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:04 pm

I've never actually mounted an animal's head on the wall but it doesn't really bother me if somebody else does it as long as they didn't just discard the carcass. I just don't see a problem with putting a stuffed animal on the wall if you have the rest of it in the freezer. I've yet to meet anyone who killed a trophy sized animal without putting an awful lot of work and money into it. The biggest bear I ever killed was just over 350 pounds and I put at least an hour per pound into getting that sucker. I've also never heard of a wild animal being an unsuspecting victim. That's pretty much a contradiction of "wild animal".

Gypsy-Vanner · Post by **Gypsy-Vanner** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 8:41 pm

Yeah, I don't have much of an issue with hunting if they are following the same values as Cash/Apollo both support but this dentist has none of the morals that the majority of hunters have. I mean, some of the biggest activists for animal welfare are hunters but I have not read anything yet about this dentist that shows any indication that he does anything with the flesh of the animal.

I think hunting carnivores is pretty stupid actually. Not to many people care for the taste of it's meat so they are hunted for trophies and little else. So many of the big land predators are at risk or are endangered. Many big predators are apex animals so their extinction has bad consequences for our ecosystem. Scientists really did not know the extent of the affect on our ecosystem when wolves were eradicated from the mid-west but holy shit, when they were reintroduced to that area there were significant changes. Good changes. Scientists pulled mountains of empirical data showing just how costly the extinction of an apex predator can be.

Now, if Digby were here he'd make sure to point out that animals are becoming extinct all the time. It's just nature and to think we can do anything about it is arrogant (<he did say this FYI over on IMDB). Digby of course is an idiot. Nature derived extinctions is one thing being we cannot control nature and that meteor that could crash into earth killing us all however human caused extinctions is preventable and within our best interests to seize and desist.

Kind of like global warming...OMG it happens and has happened in our past so it's arrogant to think we can do anything about it...except for when it's caused by humans and we can do something about it.

Yeah...I hate the dentist but wanting to chop his balls off isn't going to solve anything.

Post by **OpiateOfTheMasses** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 10:15 pm

CashRules wrote:It proves they can hit what they're shooting at. Besides, I oppose hunting just to be killing something. But as long as somebody eats what they kill and it's not an endangered species then it shouldn't be seen as a problem by anybody.

I've already stated I have no issue with people hunting if they eat what they kill. But I'm pretty sure that lions aren't generally eaten by any cultures.

So if the only purpose of them shooting the animal is to demonstrate their marksmanship skills, then I start to have an issue with it, because that just smacks of wanton waste/cruelty/vindictiveness/take-your-pick...

CashRules · Post by **CashRules** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 12:33 am

So, this piece of shit dentist and his guides (because he's a wuss who can't do his own hunting) baited this lion to lure it off the protected reserve to an area where they could "legally" kill it. He also has at least one poaching conviction in the U.S. for killing a black bear in a protected area and then lying about where it was killed. He belongs in prison.

Cassius Clay · Post by **Cassius Clay** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 1:59 am

I just heard that Jimmy Kimmel broke down on his show while talking about Cecil. Then Aamer Rahman tweeted that he was inducting Kimmel into the white tears hall of fame for crying over an animal being killed in another country but never for people being killed like animals in his own country.

Laughing. my. motherfucking. ass. off.

Dr_Liszt · Post by **Dr_Liszt** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:03 am

Aamer Rahman is my idol.

Cassius Clay · Post by **Cassius Clay** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:57 am

He's a funny mofo that frequently uses twitter to take succinct humorous jabs at contemporary white supremacy. You should check out his twitter if you haven't already.

Dr_Liszt · Post by **Dr_Liszt** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:59 am

I don't have twitter because I'm an uncool grandma that doesn't know how that works.

But when I grow up. I want to be just like Aamer.

Cassius Clay · Post by **Cassius Clay** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:01 am

Well, you're in luck 'cause you don't need it to look at someone's tweets, grandma.

Dr_Liszt · Post by **Dr_Liszt** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:12 am

Oh.

Well.... Now that I'm looking at it, he's posting about some Adam Goodes.

Cassius Clay · Post by **Cassius Clay** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:47 am

Probably something related to Australia. He posts a lot about racism in Australia since that's where he's from.

Gypsy-Vanner · Post by **Gypsy-Vanner** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:24 pm

Yeah...the hubbub over Cecil is really annoying. I mean yeah, it upset me because I was invested in his life having kept tabs on him and all that but it's definitely a "white people" reaction to be so angry about it. I shared a facebook post by some chick who made some pretty awesome points about this whole thing.

Cassius Clay · Post by **Cassius Clay** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 3:36 pm

I think it's okay to be angry/upset about it. I'm angry about it too. But I think the criticism is that white america is only choosing to be upset about this, but never about more important things. So many celebrities publicly expressing their frustration at Cecil getting killed, yet never a word about police brutality.

It's okay to be angry about both, but if you have to choose one to be angry about, it probably shouldn't be Cecil.

Blade Azaezel · Post by **Blade Azaezel** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:25 pm

There are thousands of migrants stranded in Calais at the moment, hoping to get into the UK because their countries have gone to hell. What are the English people angry about? Damn foreigners stealing their jobs and coming here illegally. Fuck me, maybe they should be angrier about the shitty state of affairs in Africa and the Middle East, rather than whether some poor, starving, homeless immigrant is trying to sneak into a country that's actually worth living in...on account of how it spent 100s of years making theirs worse for its own gain.

Dr_Liszt · Post by **Dr_Liszt** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:33 pm

The whole immigration thing is resolved by giving us jobs. That is resolved by removing proteccionist laws. That is resolved by renegotiating trading deals between countries. Which is resolved by the first world giving up a leeeeeetle bit of their oppressive deals against us.

Is very hypocritical.

Blade Azaezel · Post by **Blade Azaezel** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:36 pm

Dr_Liszt wrote:The whole immigration thing is resolved by giving us jobs. That is resolved by removing proteccionist laws. That is resolved by renegotiating trading deals between countries. Which is resolved by the first world giving up a leeeeeetle bit of their oppressive deals against us.

Is very hypocritical.

Don't you start, your politics is ridiculous

Dr_Liszt · Post by **Dr_Liszt** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:38 pm

You are the one calling a non Marxist a Marxist.

No but seriously, my country would be so much better if someone were just to remove the laws that protect national industry. And is pretty much the same for any colonized country.

Blade Azaezel · Post by **Blade Azaezel** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:15 pm

You'll have to explain that one to me...he says, dreading the response.

Dr_Liszt · Post by **Dr_Liszt** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:39 pm

Because over here we are strangled by monopolies. Even if you look at the constitution you will see there's an article explicitly banning monopolies, but when you see the industry, everything is owned by a group of families. So why is that? Because we have national industry protection laws, which bans people via taxes, importing or exporting any goods that will cause competition to the national industry. Therefore you can't open certain businesses or make yourself richer because the laws won't let you. Basically all capitalism works this way, except over here is worse. So everything is already owned by the elite, there's no private initiative, you can't import cheaper food or anything.

Also the laws are made so certain people can compete at a global scale and that's where the FTA (Free Trade Agreement) laws come at play, since the taxing is established by the FTA according to privileges. The problem I see is that if my country produces more food than Honduras, why does it have a malnourishment of 60% while Honduras is significantly lower? Because Honduras's food is cheaper and their FTA is not as disadvantageous as the one we signed, because getting chicken and meat here to compete with the national industry is not profitable but the taxing makes the prices higher. Eliminating competition.

So all of this is obvious more complex and it has its roots from colonization, from the seizing of the lands, to granting privileges of the resources to the U.S and others, and now via globalization and stuff, we are pretty much getting screwed. So obviously, theoretically, by removing the FTA laws or renegotiating more profitable taxations for the average population, it will mean more competition, more jobs, better prices, etc, etc, etc. Although I've heard the counterargument for this, and it makes sense. So we are screwed no matter what.

sikax · Post by **sikax** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:12 pm

This just in: Killing Cecil the lion is like abortion, but for lions. Or something.

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la ... tml#page=1

Gypsy-Vanner · Post by **Gypsy-Vanner** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:33 pm

I think the way to stop this senseless killing is to:

1. Raise taxes on the wealthy
2. Overhaul the education system to reduce the disparity between wealthy/poor, white/black education
3. Deport Justin Beiber to Zimbabwae to feed the starving lions
4. Put the homosexuals into conversions clinics
5. All the cows that are freed from slavery should be exported to country of Africa to feed the poor
6. Declare John Wayne to be a horrible human being
12. Convert to renewable green energy sources like wind and solar
32. Build a 40 foot wall around Texas and then toss in all the minks that were freed from mink farms

CashRules · Post by **CashRules** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:51 pm

What we've learned the past few days:

1) The people in Zimbabwe are so happy that their biggest worry is someone shooting a lion that was so old he probably needed to go anyway.
2) Releasing farm-raised minks into an unprepared ecosystem is not a form of terrorism.
3) Capitalism is bad because reduced competition (the antithesis of capitalism) is bad. Actually this one has been going on for years but it will always be one of my favorites. It also rears its ugly head in the strangest of places.
4) Az doesn't really care for some people's political opinions.
5) Turtles.

Derived Absurdity · Post by **Derived Absurdity** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 11:17 pm

Just for lulz:

http://www.vox.com/2015/7/30/9074547/ce ... in/5654656" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Unvoiced_Apollo · Post by **Unvoiced_Apollo** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 8:52 pm

Derived Absurdity wrote:Just for lulz:

http://www.vox.com/2015/7/30/9074547/ce ... in/5654656" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I suddenly have a craving for chicken

.

CashRules · Post by **CashRules** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 9:04 pm

Now another poacher has killed Cecil's brother, the only other male lion in the pride. Another group of males will kill all the cubs within a week. This is one hell of a soap opera.

Blade Azaezel · Post by **Blade Azaezel** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 9:16 pm

I just read an article from an hour ago saying the brother is alive and well, and they plan to check in on him tomorrow. Earlier articles said he might be dead, so I'm just assuming this is the most accurate.

CashRules · Post by **CashRules** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 9:40 pm

Okay, maybe it's a false alarm. But at least we have something important to distract us from the cops gunning down citizens and violently pulling them from their cars for smoking.

Post by **Gendo** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 1:58 am

Unvoiced_Apollo · Post by **Unvoiced_Apollo** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 4:23 pm

Gendo wrote:

Zebra lives matter, gazelle lives matter, all lives matter.